tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post3636492687698748964..comments2023-11-27T01:40:12.441-08:00Comments on EATEN BY DUCKS: FOLLOW UP: How we doin?Marcel Ruijtershttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00364661262187868819noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-11276360540092210542009-07-01T01:48:18.578-07:002009-07-01T01:48:18.578-07:00You're a liar and an imbecile. But thank you, ...You're a liar and an imbecile. But thank you, my English has improve: now, I know that delude and delude oneself are sometime the same.You are exeptional Uland, the most exeptional you are more exeptional than people who aren't as exeptional as you. Your English is far better than non-native speakers. You're coward. <br />L.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-74328410853319579412009-06-30T19:14:15.655-07:002009-06-30T19:14:15.655-07:00YES THOSE TWO FORMS ARE DIFFERENT BUT THEY COULD N...YES THOSE TWO FORMS ARE DIFFERENT BUT THEY COULD NOT BE INTERPRETED DIFFERENTLY GIVEN THE SUBJECT OF THE SENTENCE.TO TRANSLATE IT IN ANY OTHER WAY WOULD SOUND CLUNKY AND AWKWARD AS IT AS USED SO COMMONLY IN VERNACULAR ENGLISH IN THE WAY I PRESENTED IT.<br /><br />I HAVE ACKNOWLEDGED THE OTHER ERROR MANY,MANY TIMES. <br /><br />I SUGGEST YOU DIRECT YOUR PASSION FOR PERFECT USE OF LANGUAGE TOWARD IMPROVING YOUR ENGLISH. <br /><br />You're a common asshole, Gaspard. Nothing more.Ulandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03338733786961755063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-40995403540045223972009-06-30T09:11:51.352-07:002009-06-30T09:11:51.352-07:00I had to ask here:
http://help.berberber.com/foru...I had to ask here:<br /><br />http://help.berberber.com/forum6/96665-two-little-questions.html<br /><br />(when you posted the interview)And you were just saying crap. You made me waist too much time Uland.<br /><br />(Mike): I am a native English speaker and I can confirm that your translation:<br />I don’t think so, at any rate not me, and I don’t think/feel that the French wake up in the morning saying « Fuck, I really hate those Americans! »<br />is correct. <br />I don't see how anybody, with an elementary knowledge of French, could have misunderstood this sentence, the meaning of which is very clear. The translation which you were given would only be correct if the French text had been: "je n'ai pas le même sentiment que les Français qui se réveillent..." <br /><br />Jukka: First of all, the two verbs: "delude" and "delude oneself" are morphologically different (the first one is transitive while the latter is reflexive), which implies a difference in meaning as well. <br /><br />"to delude" = 'leurrer quelqu'un'/ 'to deceive the mind or judgment of someone (Merriam-Webster Dictionary) or 'to mislead the mind or judgment of' (The Free Online Dictionary)<br /><br />"delude oneself" = 'se leurrer', se faire des illusions, s'abuser'/ 'to deceive oneself, to be mistaken, to indulge in illusions'Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-65304342790480315702009-06-30T04:18:13.747-07:002009-06-30T04:18:13.747-07:00No you're wrong.No you're wrong.Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-61740668972178859942009-06-28T09:08:24.648-07:002009-06-28T09:08:24.648-07:00Holy shit...
I'm not why you wouldn't beli...Holy shit...<br />I'm not why you wouldn't believe me that the word, given the subject and predicate of the sentence, could not be understood in any other way to anyone familiar with vernacular English. There is no other subject in the sentence, so the word could not be applied to any other subject. Of course it might be to a native French speaker- I'm not sure because my French is limited- <b>which is why I included the French text.</b>..Ulandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03338733786961755063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-4282010164434227682009-06-28T00:24:19.038-07:002009-06-28T00:24:19.038-07:00BTW Uland Delude and delude oneself don't have...BTW Uland Delude and delude oneself don't have the same meaning. <br />L.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-25841453500460294452009-06-27T04:04:23.779-07:002009-06-27T04:04:23.779-07:00Uland : truce ; you stay on your positions, I stay...Uland : truce ; you stay on your positions, I stay on mine. You perfectly know that if any of us surrender it will be humiliating for both of us. I must admit that some of your critiques were interesting “I enjoy entering into those safe spaces where extremes can be viewed from a distance » was also very reasonable. You’re very welcome to discuss anything on my posts. <br /><br />Welcome Matt (I especially liked the purple and the green pictures of your on Jeffrey’s post.<br /><br />LogoemeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-75332547084319593922009-06-27T02:25:44.288-07:002009-06-27T02:25:44.288-07:00Hey! It looks like Matt Kish *has* joined us -- lo...Hey! It looks like Matt Kish *has* joined us -- looking forward to anything he has to offer. Would especially be interested in seeing some process-oriented posts, I know he and I exchanged a few brief emails about that but I never got around to posting anything here...<br /><br />Welcome aboard, Matt.Jeffrey Meyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08555472715577841881noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-60547531465679250812009-06-27T00:07:41.647-07:002009-06-27T00:07:41.647-07:00BTW I perfectly understand the way people use non-...BTW I perfectly understand the way people use non-formalistic English.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-17453178554302584352009-06-27T00:02:47.488-07:002009-06-27T00:02:47.488-07:00And after all you may be unhappy because the first...And after all you may be unhappy because the first comment of this post was a sarcasm about your very ostensible and formalistic post “we should discuss how we invite new persons” and the fact that you’ve just invited someone without introducing him. BTW, I didn’t say I wasn’t OK with that.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-41034784447225507502009-06-26T23:55:56.618-07:002009-06-26T23:55:56.618-07:00I didn’t write Sean wasn’t acting correctly, did I...I didn’t write Sean wasn’t acting correctly, did I? Could you tell me where I said Sean wasn’t acting correctly? You wrote "Let's not forget that the first demand you made was not correct when you make your demands” https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=6296718040957139322&postID=3172362068436992941 : Seriously you're pretending my demand wasn’t correct, you mean it wasn’t correct because I was friendly? Read the comments on Frederic’s post. You condescended when I tried to help you, I wrote you an email (after my picture hug) about this so we would have no explanation on a public space, you didn’t care. So we had a common story and you didn’t care about it; you were incapable to deal with emotional dimensions and understand that I had been offended and I wasn’t going to let you wave the flag of art criticism. I’m quite happy to know that you have rights on what Frederic is saying, I don’t. I never though I had. Is there someone here who can write: Any translator can translate the way they want and nobody has the right to discuss the translation: it is the propriety of the translator. Also I guess we are never going to discuss what some artists of the XXth century though about art criticism but I just let you know that I’m not going to applaud you. I don’t want to deal with you. I don’t know why art criticism should be more acceptable than insults.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-84123939438688975452009-06-26T14:46:35.164-07:002009-06-26T14:46:35.164-07:00There is no reason to continue this debate, Logoem...There is no reason to continue this debate, Logoeme. However this debate makes you feel, or whatever associations its creating in your mind is not really everybody elses' concern. At least that's what I think you're saying. <br />I'm going to chalk some of it up to misunderstanding, but the rest I'll just let sit. <br />It's about tone, more than anything else. You have no reason to feel a sense of propriety over my interview with Frederic, for instance. You have no reason to tell Sean he's not interacting correctly. You have no place erasing other peoples' comments.<br /><br />It's one thing to disagree, but to assume everyone should adapt to your preference is just not going to work. <br />If you feel condescended towards, or on Raymonds' behalf, there is really nothing I can do about it. I don't think anything I wrote was out of line or mean spirited.I'm being honest, that it. <br /><br />There are millions of things you could browse around for that you might deem incorrect. I'm sure there are many mistranslations out there. I suggest you take those on, if you really believe you have the authority to demand changes. Let's not forget that the first demand you made was not correct when you make your demands. <br />Where this sense of authority comes from, I don't know, but when dealing with me, you're going to have to restrain it if you want to communicate in any way. <br />Deal?Ulandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03338733786961755063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-88139315039489230392009-06-26T14:05:29.616-07:002009-06-26T14:05:29.616-07:00Yes, please do that post about Columbine Jeffrey a...Yes, please do that post about Columbine Jeffrey and carry on with the film stills etc.zekehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13192536574475293521noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-31479891010221704462009-06-26T13:57:25.791-07:002009-06-26T13:57:25.791-07:00You should do that post, Jeffrey, I'm interest...You should do that post, Jeffrey, I'm interested in reading it.Aeronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15743156867815095055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-26447965898132485192009-06-26T13:51:02.562-07:002009-06-26T13:51:02.562-07:00Uland: You said I had preferences. I have no prefe...Uland: You said I had preferences. I have no preferences. I was open minded and liked tones of stuff. But now, I’m just trying to think about who rejected me, who didn’t say much, who argued with me, who were connected to my friends, who said “I’m going to make art with you”, and who is making art with me. Art critics do not interest me much. I just like to contextualise and encounter art. But as I realised that the art world was divided and petty I’ve decided I should position -may be not all the time actually, my cousin said what’s peculiar about art is that it’s vain. That’s fun.Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-68164902169896697722009-06-26T13:47:14.848-07:002009-06-26T13:47:14.848-07:00Logoeme, my "???" was in response to you...Logoeme, my "???" was in response to your comment about my Matt Kish posting. I like his work, so I posted examples of it and suggested folks have a look at his site. He wasn't involved other than his gracious comments, and I felt posting examples of his stuff in a flattering context was sufficent enough and self-explanatory, so that's why there was no commentary or introduction by me or him.<br /><br />I'm not sure if you thought he was a new member and just started posting things unexplained, or what. I think it'd be great if he contributed here, but that's not the issue -- I posted his work because I liked it and felt other members and readers here would as well.<br /><br />And that, to me, is the purpose of this blog: INSPIRATION. I post here and read others' posts because I value what I see here, political and idealoical and aesthetic differences notwithstanding.<br /><br />I wouldn't mind some "regular" blogging on the site either, frankly, as long as it's more or less in the same spirit as what we've got going on. Which is why I've posted the occasional batch of film screen-grabs, or posts refering to other artists, or book reviews or whatever... I think anything goes as long as we can interpret through the lens of the blog, which I think is fair to say is a pretty wide-angle view, which is a good thing. I mean, I've been obsessed with the Columbine shootings lately and was mulling the idea of a post about that -- I think it would have a lot to say about our relationship to art and our ideas about "outsiders" and so forth.<br /><br />But I dunno...Jeffrey Meyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08555472715577841881noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-37637934817579634442009-06-26T12:49:19.912-07:002009-06-26T12:49:19.912-07:00You wrote: “you're in no position to tell any ...You wrote: “you're in no position to tell any of us how to deal with one another.”<br />I never told you how to deal with other people, did I? Then, are you in position to tell me how I should deal with you?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-69360722207689354682009-06-26T12:37:52.618-07:002009-06-26T12:37:52.618-07:00The text wasn’t mine. Yea right. Was it yours? So ...The text wasn’t mine. Yea right. Was it yours? So I had no right to say that the translation was disrespectful to the text. Right. Then you have the right to write whatever you want about what people said as long as they don’t speak English. Right. I understand. I don’t give a fuck about Mano I wanted as well to know who he was. But the way you criticised his work had exactly the same structure as when you criticised mine. I felt your attitude was condescending. So you though I asked you to cow to my demands and that, because you didn’t, I though it was a personal slight against me ? (I just wanted to help you to do it best.) Then, when you though this, you were condescending because I didn’t ask you to cow. You haven’t got more rights than I have about what people wrote. Making a respectful translation isn’t about cowing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-79801746502671533882009-06-26T11:56:55.670-07:002009-06-26T11:56:55.670-07:00Here are my final words on the subject:
About the...Here are my final words on the subject:<br /><br />About the Frederic interview: <br />Logoeme: It is not your text! That you feel you should have the authority to "correct" any one elses' text is infuriating. Offering suggestions is one thing, but to demand changes is absurd. Why do you think I didn't respond to it for a while? <br />The initial changes you demanded were a result of misunderstanding vernacular English. I explained it over and over again, but you would not leave it alone. The second correction was valid, and I made it. You must realize that you have no authority over any text unless you write it. <br />Your first mistake was to forget that, and your second was to interpret my unwillingness to cow to your demands as a personal slight against you: Now it's not about the precious text you've co-opted, it's about your precious feelings. You had no business approaching it in the way you did to begin with! I fixed the fucking mistake and you're still whining about it!<br />You're going to have to accept that your perceptions aren't going to rule the day. I am telling you with confidence that there is no way the mistranslation would've been construed as "racist". The question itself was tongue-in-cheek, playing with the idea that French people are hostile to Americans. It would be commonly viewed as jokey because no one would take that kind of stereotype seriously. <br />As far as Raymond goes, YOU CAN CHOOSE TO DEAL WITH HIM HOWEVER YOU LIKE. Many of us have had experiences with Ray in the past that were less than enjoyable. I believe Ray was asked to introduce himself, and he did not. I converse with Ray via email maybe once per month, and we talk about each others' work in the same tone I used in my comment. And guess what? If you didn't agree with it, or like it in general, you're free to speak up.<br />Some did, I remember, and I feel like I dealt with them appropriately.<br />I'm not interested in being a part of this blog if it means I have to bullshit people. If I feel I have criticisms to offer, I'm going to. That's all there is to it. The great thing about it all is that YOU DON"T HAVE TO AGREE. If the subject can't deal with it, I don't know what to do about that. Everything I offer is with full knowledge that my own work should be subject to criticism as well. I deserve it. Everyone does. <br /><br />There just may be things going on between people that you don't have knowledge of, Logeome., and even if you do, you're in no position to tell any of us how to deal with one another. Seans' comment to Ray may have seemed hostile, but it was clearly a knowingly flippant way of dealing with him. Again, I don't think you understand vernacular , or street English. Believe me, Ray can handle that kind of thing. <br />I don't really value this kind of henpecking. I just don't see what the point is. I like how much you put into your posts, and am obviously interested enough in your subjects to put some thought into commenting on them. It doesn't mean I have to adore the work. We're not children. <br />If you feel embarrassed by all of this, then don't get these balls rolling. All of it seems to me to stem from your desire to impose your preferences. We all have preferences. We can either talk about them in a clear way and negotiate, or we can't. <br />You can either accept and make room for things going on here that you don't like and deal with differences in a relevant, respectful way, or you can't. Time to choose. <br />If you can't do it, I'll just choose to avoid interaction with you.Ulandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03338733786961755063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-10750609384585946672009-06-26T11:31:16.567-07:002009-06-26T11:31:16.567-07:00Well Uland may be we should forget about all that....Well Uland may be we should forget about all that. I like your stuff I think you liked mine (you wrote it I guess it’s true). All that just reminds me of artists of the twentieth century having arguments… And then they divided. But when they were all together their work was more fertile. Honestly, for example, who cares now if art has to be abstract or figurative?Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-54198478797648528152009-06-26T11:14:33.389-07:002009-06-26T11:14:33.389-07:00I'll add that i really value Logoeme's ene...I'll add that i really value Logoeme's energy & enthusiasm on this blog. Having the interviews & the art & the consistency is nice, you quickly rose to being a key member of the group.SEANhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18236717038521645585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-78436862784899850362009-06-26T11:11:04.650-07:002009-06-26T11:11:04.650-07:00And BTW I'm not arguing because I want to impr...And BTW I'm not arguing because I want to impressed people, I’m ashamed in a way and I don’t like this. But then where else could we do it?Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-1237528877875805262009-06-26T11:01:42.165-07:002009-06-26T11:01:42.165-07:00I know you're right Aeron but as it seems to b...I know you're right Aeron but as it seems to be about freedom of speach I'd like to write this to Uland. A mistake inside a translation is a mistake. It is disrespectful to the text you translated not to have corrected it. I needed tree comment to make you realise it was a mistake you even wrote it didn’t matter! You just ignored what I was telling as you often do. This is a good example to understand your strategy and the way you don’t care about people. And by the way the mistake would be perceived as racism you may laugh but it was. So it’s not a minor mistake it changes the content. You invited manosturbo on the blog then when he arrived you didn’t introduced him, you didn’t even give him a warm welcome. Sean was surprised so he asked him “who the fuck are you?” But manosturbo wanted to use the language in a “surrealist way” so he played with the confusion, and didn't say who he was. I was provocative with him so he would tell us who he was, he didn't. Then Aeron who’s always a good moderator said to us who he was. You didn’t write anything to welcome him not even “hello”. Then on his third post you just applied you “art criticism” as you call it and said to him you could easily walk away from his work!!! (His comics at first wasn’t readable and you dared say you understood that you could easily walk away from it.)That was your first comment on the posts your “friend” made. I don’t think he felt at ease. He even had to justify which was just horrible because obviously he wanted to use the language in a dreamy surrealist way, he needed to feel at ease, you didn’t make him feel at ease. He haven’t posted since. Then you went on my picture hug and you just did the same thing: you said you could easily walk away from my work. But it was just a humble picture: there was no need to think it had to be controversial or challenging. I hated that. Now you make a post about interior matters and you tell me that I wrote things which were not OK, you just said we could write anything we wanted, didn’t you ? So your post about interior concerns apparently do not tolerate everything and what I wrote was right: we cannot discuss everything here and maybe you made this ostensible post so everything cannot be discussed. I mean if you didn’t think the EBD discussion group was interesting you should have told it. I may remind you that there was a comment on the blog which was about the fact that we needed it. I deleted the comment on my picture because I thought you were in a difficult position and it was not good for you. It is quite fun that you deleted the blog where we had an argument about translation. So I’ll undo them soon. Also why are you always reminding that you were one of the first persons who posted on here? It seems that on one hand you write you’re just one of us and on the other hand the first persons here can write what ever they want but new comers should be careful about not being “fanatics”. Am I a “fanatic” when defend art I like. When I attacked contemporary drawing you didn’t defend it.Gaspard Pitiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09620580282231471133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-27918087320985826862009-06-26T11:00:09.796-07:002009-06-26T11:00:09.796-07:001. Keep the content to art, but go ahead & add...1. Keep the content to art, but go ahead & add little bits to your art post if they add to the piece. Like if there is a theme song to a piece or music you were listening to while working on it, or ideas with links that are relevant or artists who are inspiring.<br />2. I love these arguments but i have no idea what is going on here & have a sneaking suspicion that neither do Luke or Logoeme.<br />3. Luke is completely correct that I don't care about controlling certain elements of the blog. I personally love it when these giant arguments break out. It might look like reality TV, but when reality TV is done right, it's glorious. Anyone watch the first few seasons of The Surreal Life? MAN!<br />4. You are all racist & i hate you.<br />5. Mollusk Man has a good idea in looking in the FLICKR pool for new blood. I think also just seeing who wants to be on EBD might be a good way to go, instead of asking. It should be like the Masons, 2B1ASK1.SEANhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18236717038521645585noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37678750.post-4888631966306160912009-06-26T10:10:28.471-07:002009-06-26T10:10:28.471-07:00Logœme, don't leave, you contribute a lot of g...Logœme, don't leave, you contribute a lot of great content on here. I'm sure between the language barrier, which is amazing to have someone who has English as a second language on here, and any preconceived ideas of what a group blog should be, can set things off in weird directions.<br /><br />I think the best attitude to have here is that only we the contributing artists and maybe a handful of other artists are reading it. Not to say that is all who do read the blog, but just treat it like that.Aeronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15743156867815095055noreply@blogger.com